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Finally watching this reaction...sigh...I have yet to finish this episode all the way through cause I hate the cringe sooo much but I want to up to date on your reactions for tomorrow. Here we go...

I think Skyen just convinced me to like this episode.... To be fair. My personal reason for disliking it is because Moxxie is uncharacteristically annoying when he's normally one of my favorite characters. I only wish the A and B plot were switched somehow. Your reading on it made me appreciate it more.

I can't decide if the LA water joke becomes more or less funny when you know that water is 100% acid.

So when he asked why Vaggie didn't want a bar in hotel because alcohol isn't a sin, from my perspective (a chrisitan from Croatia(many people would put it in Balkan and we drink a lot there)) we don't see alcohol itself as a sin but the addiction. Any sort of addiction is a sinn (i asked my priest about this specificaly) so what i think Vaggie didn't want to support alcoholism, not make them not drink at all.

This was probably the only episode of the show I ever watched that I genuinely just didn't like (besides the Barbie Wire stuff). Some episodes I felt pretty meh about, but idk something about the writing of this one throws me off. Though upon rewatch, while I still think it's bad, it's more fun bad.

If I had to guess the wall thing probably got brought over from when the IMP cast were hazbin characters. wouldn't be surprised if it was key to one of their stories in hazbin and it just kinda got ported over as a running joke in both shows when they split

personally its one of my least favorite episodes for a few reasons -regardless of intentionality and in spite of moxxie's crossdressing being a pre-established, reoccurring thing, his performance in this episode reads as classic transmisogyny. 'haha, its funny, a man is dressed as a woman, everyone laugh'. it's just fucking tasteless -cringe comedy isnt fuckin funny. i can stomach it but that doesnt mean im entertained by it -jokes like teenagers sending millie nudes + barbie sexually manipulating teens is, while in line with the baseline edginess of the show, is gross actually the bones of the episode are fine, but the actual jokes are just tasteless, and not even in the brandon rogers style pushing the edginess so far its absurd. you CAN read it as moxxies need to perform/some actual serious gender stuff, but i truly do not believe that was the intention. i actually agree with the things that are good are good, and that giving m+m some actual relationship conflict is good, and i actually really like showing how insecurity can hurt people you love, and agree that western energy is a worse episode structurally and tonally

an episode which i usually skip during my rewatches of the show and like with many in your chat, you managed to make me see it in a new light. thankful for you!

the childhood friends thing is so. i don’t even care if it’s bad writing. to me it is like many aspects of the show, just shamelessly self indulgent. and its self indulgent in a way that i am all too happy to indulge in. it is one of my FAVORITE romance tropes (which is all ace attorney’s fault) which makes this one of my favorite episodes of the entire series. it’s not for everyone. i don’t care. it’s for me.

I really wish I could meet someone like her, god i want to meet people and get to know em but fuck if it isn't like pulling teeth when you're never talked to by anyone

Personally, I think the worst HB episode is the non-important part of Full Moon, just because I wished the whole gave more time to Blitz and Stolas.

Still about 30 minutes in, so not sure if you end up with a different read later on, but fascinating. I think a lot of the "gender" being explored here is about roles. When Moxxie goes to play as a female, he finds that it is difficult, frightening, and stifling. Just to get his "leg in the door" so to speak takes a level of put togetherness and social ability that isn't his strong suit. On the other hand, for Millie, she's getting to experience some of what it's like being a man. There are double standards and expectations where men can be idolized without needing to be perfectly dressed, perfectly put together, socially submissive, etc. Moxxie is experiencing the difficulty there is in presenting as a woman, and Millie is experiencing some of the advantages of presenting as a man. I think the clincher on this read is the ending to the conflict, where we refocus and realize that yes, Millie was right all along, but she was sort of spoken over and accepted it because she felt the need to cater to Moxxie's emotional needs, which I read as a very female struggle. It's sort of like the She-hulk thing, where Bruce banner talks about all the time it took him to get the Hulk under control, and when a female becomes a hulk, that comes very easily to her, because of the reality of living as a woman. This whole episode feels like a similar lesson being taught to Moxxie.

Millerd can get it

I feel like whether somebody enjoys this episode or not mostly hinges on if secondhand embarrassment/cringe comedy is their cup of tea. I can see why some people would enjoy it, and I'm happy for them, but while I was watching this episode when it first came out, almost every time Mox talked, I legitimately had to skip ahead because it was physically painful for me to watch, especially during his song on the beach.

Honestly, I never really got why this episode got so much hate. Sure, Moxxie is acting cringe, but it's 100% on purpose. OOPS on the other hand is an episode I wish got more hate because SPOILERS It rushes the Fizz and Blitzo plotline and pretty much solves everything in one episode

Striker should've gotten one of Stolas' eyes.

I do think the gags and jokes here work better than in the Hollywood episode, Spring Breakers or Cherubs. The parentheses of the subtitles viciously turning on Moxxine as well is particularly excellent.

1:30:00 so is that elmie or is it barno?

I'm calling it right now. Stella and/or Andrealphus is going to approach Stolas with you get full custody of Octavia and I/we get everything else.

Is it really "off the rails" if we expect it to be excessively long at this point?

I may be wrong but I think it's less about gender and more about the attention/validation. Millie does have a lot of siblings Edit: chat said it better than I could: eldest child syndrome

Not a spoiler, just a theory, at the time of writing: Striker's beef with Stolas is definitely a "sins of the father shall be heaped upon the son" type of revenge.

I came here to watch a funny man say funny things and watch the funny imp show. I did not expect to be called out on my hypervigilant trauma fawning behavior goddammit xD (But I do appreciate it, thank you Skyen)

Honestly I think people were mad it 'interrupted' the Stolitz plot and that Barbie was the b-plot. Also a thing about Gen Z disliking cringe/secondhand embarrassment humor or something (some people apparently cant stand the stolitz scene from circus for similar reasons) i dunno...

For me, the issue is that the story ended last episode with a dramatic revelation. And the next episode is mostly goofing around in comparison - though it explores the relationship between Moxxie and Millie. And it resolves with Blitz finding his sister who wants nothing to do with him and it feels like this episode perhaps should have happened earlier. The audience wanted more of Blitz and Stolas and instead, we got a side quest with character development with characters we weren't immediately concerned about due to the revelation last episode. Also, a lot of the humour didn't land for me. Also Season 2 was a huge jump for me; so this episode felt like things were slipping back towards what I didn't like in Season 1.

i really hate the way andre interacts with stella. he keeps touching her in weirdly intimate ways . that is your sister? stop it??

2:16:40 - I also feel like it can be read as Stolas thinking about getting a pair of those crystals and proposing them as a convenient way of either for two of them to be meeting or as a way out of this relationship too, because the way I see Stolas he's thoghtful and attentive enough to understand that the current state of things is grating for Blitz, so hmmm, curious where they'll take it.

So the thing with the background characters is more like native populations to the rings. Imps being an outlier because they’re everywhere, but each ring seems to have a general motif for its native demons. Pride is also a bit of an outlier as that’s the domain of Sinners who come in all shapes, but to my knowledge Sinners aren’t allowed out of the ring while the Hellborn are free to move around. Wrath is also a bit of a question mark since we’ve only seen Imps and assorted hell beasts live there. But for the rest, Lust is the domain of succubi and incubi, Greed has a shark motif, Gluttony is the home turf for the Hellhounds, Sloth has the mishmash of goat with slight cephalopod traits and Envy seems to have a deep-sea fish aesthetic.

It's the cringe factor that was it for me. Not the theme, story or animation. I cringed so hard that i shut down my computer and went to a half hour walk after watching for a few minutes. I watched the episode in five minuted parts to get through it. This makes it my least favorite.

Even if the Cherubs ep isn't the best, it IS important since it introduces recurring characters, as well as their motive as main antagonists. Still mid tho

To me this is just a really mediocre episode. I just dont see this Moxxie as being in character. Millie was fine, but it just didnt feel right for Moxxie to turn on Millie this way, maybe it would've been interesting if it was something with Blitz, since it's already been established that Moxxie SEEKS validation from him. The songs are fine but they also feel like they lack something. The worst part is trying to make us care about Barbie while she only has a tiny bit of screentime and her introduction is SO out of nowhere and Blitz has never even MENTIONED her and suddenly we're supposed to believe that he cares this much about her? It just feels weak and like the episode doesn't earn us being invested in her. A lot of people criticize the humor but to be honest I think it's fine, I actually quite enjoyed the jokes. I would also like to say that I don't even have any stolitz bias like some people are saying, or that I was disappointed by the "Millie episode" being mostly about Moxxie, because I watched this episode long after it released lol, I wasn't even that invested in Helluva boss when I watched it, and I still feel, at best lukewarm about it, and at worst unhappy (pun intended) with it

39:34 Very well-put about being a people pleaser

i swear i feel like i comment this every single time, but DANG do i love the breath of fresh air of someone with media literacy accurately dissecting characters in a meaningful and logical way... (unlike most uwu stolas stans just not seeing beyond what the characters say to the viewers) HONESTLY, skyen, you are the one and only best to watch for good helluva reaction and analysis videos, i am beyond forever grateful for your kind heart of sharing your thoughts with us!!! make sure to take care of yourself too!! ❤

If being a people pleaser makes you selfish and a bad person/partner then I am glad I have no plans to date anyone. For I am very much a people pleaser.

In the first Striker episode, we do see Millie's parents being very loving towards her as well as undermining her with their comments. It’s nowhere near as extreme or abusive when compared to other character’s parents, but it is there. Her parents diminish her job, insult the person she chose to marry, scold her for getting taken out by Striker, and while not specifically her parents, she was also the only one banned from the ultra-violent games for being too violent and murder happy. Even in hell where murder and violence are the norm, Millie is considered to be way too much. So, her loving all this adoration, praise, and validation does make sense to me. Though that could just be me searching for a connection and I obviously wish we had more exploring Millie before this episode.

Your questions will be asnwered hehehe

God, it’s so good to see a nuanced review of Helluva Boss after spending so much time watching people throw shit at each other about it on Tumblr.

Once again Skyen's read on the characters, especially Stolas, is completely spot on and that's fucking amazing. You're a blessing to this fandom

I know I'm one of the haters, but I really think you're being too kind to the writing here. And I'm not even talking about the cringe, which I'll admit is hard to watch. I feel that this episode poorly characterizes these two and their relationship up to this point in the show and makes both of them look like immature children. Millie thus far has been depicted as the most confident and stable member of IMP. She's never once shown a single ounce of self-doubt or need for external validation. In fact, I'm pretty sure everyone in her life already gives her the validation she would need. So her tearful admission at the emotional climax feels really out of character. And then meanwhile Moxie comes off as the biggest hypocrite by scolding Millie when this was his plan all along. He's jealous that she's popular with literal children. I just can't square that away with the same character that just 2 episodes ago stood up to his controlling father in the name of this relationship with Millie. In Truth Seekers he calls Blitz out for intentionally pushing people away. In the LA episode he wants Loona to be a better professional. Every other depiction of Moxie has shown that he's emotionally intelligent and competent enough to not act the way he does this episode. I think it would have been infinitely better to lean into their established characterizations and show the flaws in them. Millie always seems to do no wrong being a headstrong physical juggernaut. Moxie is insecure and a stickler for rules and process. They showcased that in the episode, but instead of using those diametrically opposed personality traits, they contrived a mid 00s cartoon-level conflict about teenage popularity. What about a plot where Millie's over-confidence and penchant for bloodshed causes her to kill the wrong person prematurely which conflicts with Moxie's methodical plan? Or maybe flip the script and Moxie's plan actually does work and he's the one that becomes popular which feeds on his existing established insecurities, then Millie goes off to get the perp on her own and is put in danger because Moxie is too preoccupied with being popular. At least that puts their existing characterizations at odds instead of inventing new ones.

This was a character assassination episode as far as I'm concerned. It basically threw away the character development from truth seekers and the first wrath episode. His actions don't really make sense after those episodes in my opinion. Some of it? Sure, but a full week trying to force a failed character while ignoring his wife's input feels really out of character for how we've watched him develop.

This episode gives me pain, it might just be the cringe comedy, I can't watch cringe comedy without also feeling the cringe deep in my soul, it's painful to watch.

so, i'm self aware enough to know why i dislike the episode: it handled the genderswap / drag thing super light heartedly and to Moxxie's detriment, while giving Millie her overdue time in the limelight - sadly perpetuating a narrative that pays FtMs and Tomboys as more likable and socially accepted as FtMs or Femboys - clearly not helped by Moxxie's bitchy behavior and even cringeworthy bitchy voice performance. Given he is a feeler and likely INFP type of guy, there would have been a more fitting, harmonious female role or disguise easily craftable to him. I'm not against drama with the couple, but the gender subtone and Moxxie being so egocentric and petty was heavily putting me off on the episode.

I think the general consensus is that it's not "oh god that episode is terrible, I wish it didn't exist" it's more "out of every episode, this one is the worst."

Barb has scarification tattoos.

I just don't like this episode because of how annoying Moxie is in it. Yes, I know that's the point, but the fact that he's crying over a bunch of kids not liking him was particularly annoying to watch. I like the ideas behind the episode, but the execution (specifically around Moxxie) was very annoying for me. Hell, I might have liked it better if the mission had been something that didn't involve Moxie making the annoying girl voice. 🫤

to be fair for the circus, showing both blitz and stolas childhood seperate before going together could be really aquward pacing wize

Honestly, thank you so much Skyen for that part about trans validation. I think I really needed to hear that today.

3 episodes to go.

I LOVE the transness/gender-nonconformity/neurodivergence readings of these episodes, I feel like people don't appreciate it nearly enough.

I love the cringe in this episode it's so on point with the 2000's. I haven't even seen Camp Rock but can tell this episode was an homage to it. I don't get why people say Moxie's character was assassinated in this episode, he's always been extra. I like seeing him and Millie have a conflict and resolve it. I love Millie in this epsidoe. I think the biggest legitimate gripes about the episode are that the mystery who killed the client was too quick even just for the joke and also that perhaps it would've been better to give Barb more focus for her introduction.